How a Pro Wrestler Just Schooled Me on Stand-Up
Why Comedy Is More Than What or Who You Know (Comedy Mindhacks #137)
Twenty-four years ago, I met my wife, Kristi, while we were both working as counselors at a summer camp. A year later, I graduated from college, we got married, and we’ve been building a life together ever since. Looking back, one thing has become incredibly clear to me: Before I met Kristi, I had no idea what I was missing. It’s not like I woke up every morning thinking something was absent from my life. I just didn’t know there was anything missing until I encountered someone who made my life richer, fuller, and better than I could’ve ever imagined.
The older I get, the more I think that’s how learning works, too. We often imagine education is about filling gaps we already know exist. Sometimes that’s true. More often, though, I think learning introduces us to gaps we never knew were there in the first place. It isn’t just about gaining new information. It’s about discovering that there was something worth knowing all along.
Maybe that’s one of the reasons I’ve always loved learning and am one of those people who calls themselves a “lifelong learner.” Over the years I’ve earned five degrees, but I’ve also taken classes that had absolutely nothing to do with collecting diplomas. For instance, since I earned my last degree, of my own accord I’ve gone on to take classes on and study counseling, Bible and theology, comedy, resin art, and plenty of other subjects simply because I enjoy the process of learning. Looking back, I don’t think I’ve ever taken a class because I believed I already knew what I needed. I took those classes because I hoped they would introduce me to something I didn’t even know I was missing.
That realization came rushing back to me this week during a video call with Ray Lloyd, better known to wrestling fans as Glacier. If you grew up watching professional wrestling like I did, names like Dusty Rhodes, Mean Gene Okerlund, Sting, Ric Flair, and countless others weren’t just entertainers. They were part of the soundtrack of childhood. Spending an hour and a half talking with someone who lived inside that world was awesome, and hearing Ray tell stories about being mentored by Dusty Rhodes was worth the conversation all by itself.
Somewhere during our conversation, though, Ray shared something that completely caught me off guard. He mentioned the old saying, “It’s not what you know; it’s who you know.” I’d basically heard that phrase my entire life. Then he smiled and said that someone once told him there was actually a third part to the saying. I leaned in because I’d never heard that before. He said, “It’s not what you know, or who you know; it’s who’s willing to say they know you.”
Again, I’d spent years, decades even, hearing the first two parts of that quote without ever realizing there was a third. The moment Ray said it, though, I understood why it mattered. Knowing influential people isn’t nearly as valuable as becoming the kind of person they’re willing to recommend. Those are two completely different goals. One is about you simply knowing someone; the other is about someone knowing and trusting you enough to vouch for you, knowing you well enough to put their reputation on the line for you because you proved yourself to them.
I think that distinction matters in life in general and in stand-up comedy in particular because, despite what sometimes feels like a billion comedians, comedy is actually a surprisingly small world. Bookers know bookers. Club owners know club owners. Comedians recommend other comedians. Before long, people aren’t simply or only asking whether someone is funny. They’re often asking whether that person is dependable, professional, prepared, easy to work with, and someone they’d gladly spend another weekend with.
That’s what the third part of the quote captures. Every recommendation carries risk because every recommendation borrows a little bit of the recommender’s credibility. If I recommend a comedian who shows up late, treats the staff poorly, ignores the audience, or simply isn’t ready, that decision reflects back on me. When someone says, “I know this guy,” they’re often saying, “I’m willing to stake a little of my own reputation on his.”
At a company employers hire people they’re willing to trust. Publishers sign authors they’re willing to stand behind. Churches raise up leaders they’re willing to affirm. Friends introduce friends they’re willing to vouch for. Again and again, opportunities tend to flow toward people whose character gives others confidence to attach their own name to theirs.
That’s also one of the reasons I keep writing this blog, hosting podcasts, producing comedy shows, performing stand-up, teaching joke writing, and creating new things. None of it is because I’m trying to convince anyone that I’ve arrived or somehow become an expert. It’s actually the opposite. I’m simply making my own journey public because I want to keep learning, keep growing, and keep becoming the kind of person others can trust. I’d rather learn out loud than pretend I’ve already figured everything out.
Ironically, that’s the part of success I rarely thought about when I was younger. I assumed success was mostly about acquiring more knowledge or meeting the right people. Those things certainly matter, but they’re only part of the story. Knowledge may open a few doors, and relationships may introduce us to opportunities, but character determines whether people feel good about opening those doors for us in the first place.
I never expected one of the best lessons about stand-up comedy to come from a video call with a professional wrestler who’s now stepping into the comedy world. But…something I didn’t even know was missing was, indeed, missing. Ray probably thought he was simply finishing a quote I’d already heard a hundred times before. Instead, “Glacier” simply changed a little bit of the way I now think about success. It isn’t just about what I know or even who I know. It’s about becoming the kind of person others are genuinely glad to say they know.
One last thing while you’re still here: Recently, I created a new app, a tool I wish I’d have had early on: Comedian Persona Explorer. It can help comedians figure out what they didn’t realize they were missing regarding their persona. Whether you begin with a single report or continue using it as you grow, my goal in creating it is simple: I hope you’ll spend more time becoming the comedian only you can be. Check it out HERE.
Along the same lines, let me just say that, if reflections and tools like these are helpful to you, that’s also exactly why I wrote Comedy Mindhacks. My goal isn’t simply to help comedians write better jokes. It’s to help comedians understand the invisible thinking behind better comedy. Every mental model becomes another tool for building momentum, and over time those small shifts in thinking have a way of producing much bigger shifts on stage.
This entire book is built around helping comedians identify the mental obstacles, hurdle over them, and boost their momentum. If this article resonated with you, you’ll find a lot more like it inside the book. You can check out sample pages HERE. If you’re not yet a subscriber, use code MH10LIVE at checkout HERE for 10% off. Free subscribers automatically receive 15% off, and paid subscribers receive 35% off because I’m a big believer in rewarding people who invest in themselves. 👉 Click HERE to grab the book.
And if you’re ready to double down in a BIGGER way, consider joining my Comedy Vault. It’s my private collection of premium resources, trainings, workshops, and tools designed to help comedians continue growing long after the initial excitement fades. The first bet gets you into the game. Doubling down is what changes who you become.👉 Click HERE to unlock the Comedy Vault.
